Itihasa and purana are vedic in nature - 02

Note:- This below is an outstanding work done by Srila Jiva Goswami and explained by Sri Satyanarayan Babaji Maharaj who explained it meticulously in Tattva Sandarbha, A much recommended book. [link mentioned below]

We have already defined itihasa and purana in our last blog which was first in this series. now we are going to discuss on the nature of itihasa and purana.

why is it discussed? because people believe the nature of itihasa and purana is not-vedic and hence it's conclusion can't be taken as ultimate reality.

Vedas are considered to be ultimate authority over the subject matter of trans-rational truth, and itihasa and purana is considered to be non-different then the vedas.

How Itihasa and purana is non-different then the vedas?

1. Both categories of literature are without human origin. [apaureseya]

Apaureseya means "not of human authorship." The Vedas and Itihasa-Puranas are considered eternal knowledge manifested by the Supreme Being, not created by any individual person. This distinction is crucial because knowledge of trans-rational truth cannot be produced by limited human intellect but only emanates from the unlimited consciousness of Bhagavan.

"My dear maitreyi, the rg, yajur, sama and atharva vedas, s well sthe itihasas and puranas, all appear from the breathing of the supreme being" (BAU 2.4.10)

"The rg, sama, yajur, and atharva vedas appeared from the mouth of Bhagvan along with the puranas and all the devas residing in the celestial planet" (Atharva Veda 11.7.24)

"He approached the Brihaspati meter, and thus the itihasas, puranas, gathas and Narasamsis became favourable to him. One who knows this verily becomes the beloved abode of the itihasas, puranas, Gathas and Narasamsis." (AV 15.6.10-12)

"In this way, all the vedas were manifested along with the kalpas, rahasyas, Brahmanas, upanisads, itihasas, Anvakhyatas and puranas" (Gopatha Brahmana, Purva 2.10)

2. Both delineate the same specific truth.

"In the vedas, Ramayana, the puranas, and Mahabharata, Sri Hari is glorified everywhere - in the beginning, middle and end." (Skanda Purana 4.95.12)

"On the pretext of writing Mahabharata, Srila Vyasadeva explained the meaning of the Vedas. without doubt, all of the Vedas are firmly established in the puranas" (Vishnu Purana)

3. Itihasa and purana referred as 5th Veda

"Then the all-seeing Lord Brahma brought forth the fifth Veda - the puranas and the itihasas - from all his mouths. (SB 3.12.39)

"The itihasa and puranas are called the fifth veda" (SB 1.4.20)

"He taught the vedas along with the fifth of their number, Mahabharata" (MB 12.340.21)

"The fifth veda, written by Sri Krsna-Dvaipayana Vyasa, is called Mahabharata" (Bhavishya Purana)

"Venerable sir, I have studied the Rg, Yajur, Sama and atharva vedas, and also the itihasas and puranas which are the fifth veda" (Ch. Upanishad 7.1.2)

"Indeed rg, yajur, sama and atharva are the names of the four vedas. the itihasas and puranas are the fifth veda." (CHU 7.1.4)

Objection: Itihasa/purana mentioned in the vedas refer to historical passages found in the vedas and not to separate works.

Reply: The term "fifth veda" itself indicates a separate category. If itihasa and purana were merely historical passages within the four vedas, they would be counted as part of those vedas, not as a fifth distinct veda. The scriptural references consistently treat them as a separate body of knowledge, revealed and organized distinctly from the four vedas. Moreover, there are many statements about the transpersonal and vedic nature of the itihasas and puranas in the vedic samhitas, Brahmanas, Aranyakas, Upanishads and so on.

All these references shows that the itihasas and puranas have the same source and subject as the vedas.

Why Itihasas and puranas are considered as the fifth veda?

• The itihasas and puranas are called the 5th Veda because they are derived from the original veda, the Yajur veda.

"That which remains after Vyasa had divided the vedas into four parts was also Yajur Veda, this is the conclusion of the scriptures" (Vayu purana 1.60.22)

After srila vyasa compiled the four vedas, one billion verses remained from the original Yajur Veda. These verses formed the original purana, which exists in the celestial planets. From this original purana, Vyasadeva extracted five hundred thousand essential verses. He then divided four hundred thousand of these verses into the eighteen puranas, while the remaining one hundred thousand verses formed the Mahabharata. Since the puranas and itihasa are produced from the Vedas, thus it is referred as 5th Veda.

"Even today the original purana of one billion verses exists in the abode of the immortals" [MP 53.10]

"The ingenious lord abridged the Veda and then divided it into four. Therefore, He became known as Vedavyasa. He also CONDENSED the puranas into 400,000 verses which still number one billion verses in the immortal realm" [Siva Purana 7.1.1.37-38]

In Matsya purana, Supreme lord says -

"O best of the twice born, foreseeing that the puranas will gradually be neglected, I assume the form of Vyasa and abridge it in every age" (MP 53.8-9)

In other words, Srila Vyasadeva condenses the pre-existing Puranas so that the people can easily comprehend it.

SSB comments - it is important to understand that while compiling the itihasa and purana, he included some of his own statements to make the narration more easily comprehensible. For ex. in Bhagavad gita, the words "arjuna said" and "krsna said" are added by srila vyasa to help the reader understand. These additions concern the presentation and arrangement, not the essential knowledge content, which remains apaureseya.

Objection: If four vedas individually appeared from Bhagavan as mentioned. Why, then, is it said that Vyasadeva divided the one veda into four parts?

Reply: Originally four vedas were collectively called yajur veda [as yajur veda being much bigger than rest of 3]. And the vedas became disordered by the curse of Gautama and hence srila vyasa had to compile the vedas.

"In satya-yuga the knowledge that emanated from Sri Narayana remained pure. It became somewhat distorted in Tretayuga and completely so in Dvaparyuga. when ignorance had covered that knowledge because of Gautama Rsi's curse, the devas became perplexed. Led by Brahma and Rudra, they approach Sri Narayana , the ultimate shelter for those seeking refuge, and told him why they had come. on the request of the devas. Sri Hari then descended as the great yogi vyasa, son of Satyavati and Parasara and re-established the forgotten Vedas" (Skanda purana)

Objection: The puranas are occasionally described as impermanent.

Reply: the reason being they are sometimes manifest and sometimes not. for ex. Srimad Bhagavatam is believed to exist after dwapur yuga but if that is so then in Padma-purana, Uttara-khanda, Gautama advises Ambarisa Maharaja, who reigned in satya-yuga, to study Srimad Bhagavatam. The reason for this apparent contradiction is that the puranas are eternal in their nature, but their manifestation in human society is cyclical. In each age, as needed, Vyasadeva re-establishes them. Thus the puranas are eternal but they are sometimes manifest and sometimes unmanifest in human society. As Bhagavan is independent in his appearance and disappearence.

Objection: The puranas have names, such as Skanda and agni, they must have been composed by these persons and so they are neither eternal nor apaureseya.

Reply: by that logic, even upanishad and Brahmanas will be met with the same fate since they are also named after persons such as katha upanishad and aitreya brahmana which refer to sages. These were the main exponents and not writers.

Objection: Since Itihasas and puranas are written specifically for those with no access to the vedas, how can they part of the vedas?

Reply: Just as krsna name is the transcendental fruit of vedas [it (holy name of krsna) is the transcendental fruit of the creeper of all the vedas and is purely of the nature of consciousness (prabhasa-khanda, SP)] yet anyone may chant it, including those who are unqualified to study the Vedas. similarly, although the itihasas and puranas are vedic in nature even a sudra can approach them, just as he or she may chant the holy name of the lord. The accessibility of these texts to all classes does not diminish their vedic status, just as the universal accessibility of the Lord's name does not reduce its transcendental nature.

SJG further writes, even if we count the itihasas and puranas among the revealed texts that illuminate the meaning of the Vedas, they are still unique because of the extraordinary distinction of the one who manifested them - Srila Vyasadeva (An avatara of Sri Narayana himself).

".....Sri Krsna-dvaipayana Vyasa is Sri Narayana himself. Who else in this world could have brought forth the great epic Mahabharata?" (VP 3.4.2-5)

"Just as a person picks up items from his own house and uses them many people have taken knowledge from the sky of vyasa's heart for their own use" (Skanda Purana)

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Does this mean that Vedas and Puranas have no distinction?

• No, Vedas are intrinsically connected to intonation and a fixed word order, but the puranas and itihasas are not.

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Continue Reading

This is part of our series on Itihāsa and Purāṇa. Continue with the next blog:

The Divisions of the Purāṇas - Explore the traditional classification of Purāṇas and how they cater to different spiritual dispositions.

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Recommended Reading

Here are some key resources to further explore Itihāsa, Purāṇa, and their Vedic context:

• Tattva Sandarbha
  Śrī Satyanarayan Babaji Maharaj
  Read online

These texts provide foundational perspectives and detailed analysis relevant to the topics discussed in this series.

This series on Itihāsa and Purāṇa aims to provide a comprehensive understanding of their Vedic and pedagogical significance as part of our spiritual tradition.